Eileen Kwei, BA 01 – Networking with Sincerity and Authenticity

(Transcripts may contain a few typographical errors due to audio quality during the podcast recording.)

[00:00:00] Sean: Welcome to the OneHaas Alumni Podcast. I’m your host, Sean Li. And today, we’re joined by Eileen Kwei. Eileen is the Managing Director and Chief Administrative Officer of Artisan Partners, a global investment management firm that provides a broad range of high value-added investment strategies. She’s responsible for overseeing corporate functions of the firm, including talent management, human capital, DEI, corporate communications, media relations, IT, data governance, and global facilities.

I don’t know if there’s something that you don’t do, Eileen, but welcome to the podcast.

[00:00:44] Eileen: Thank you, Sean. I’m so excited to be here and have a conversation with you.

[00:00:48] Sean: Eileen, before we jump into things, I did want to mention that you were introduced to me as a leading figure in the finance sector and champion for supporting diversity in leadership. So, that’s something we definitely want to cover in this chat. But before we do that, my favorite interview question is learning about your origin story—where are you from, where’s your family from, and where you grew up.

[00:01:13] Eileen: As I think about my origin story, I probably would trace that back to two generations ago, which is where I have the most vivid memories and, probably, the most detailed family history. My grandparents on both sides fought the Chinese Civil War, between the Kuomintang or the KMT-led government and the Republic of China. So, that was the period of time where that civil war resulted in the Chinese Communist Party taking over control of mainland China.

I will say I have a pretty severe inferiority complex. I often say, and this is true, that I am the least educated and least successful person in my family. Talking about the two generations before me, on my dad’s side, my grandfather was heavily involved in politics. He was pretty instrumental in setting up the government in Taiwan after the Civil War. This is around 1949. He was a high-ranking official of the KMT Party. And he has held various political posts during his tenure. At one point, he served as the Prime Minister of Taiwan. He studied law. He traveled to the U.S. in his generation and obtained his master’s in arts in education from the Teachers College in Columbia University. My grandmother was one of the very few congresswomen at the time.

On my mom’s side, my grandmother was another trailblazer. She was the first female dentist who established her own dental practice in Taiwan. She also traveled to the U.S. to study dental medicine and oral surgery at Stanford. My grandfather established one of the first banks in Taiwan.

That’s two generations who preceded me. So, my parents, my dad was one of the longest tenured legislators in Taiwan. He also studied law and furthered his education here in the U.S. and obtained a doctorate in history from NYU. While my dad was pursuing his PhD, my mom pursued her master’s in computer science. That’s when I was born.

[00:03:40] Sean: Wow.

[00:03:40] Eileen: I feel like it’s a pretty typical Asian family story. A lot of it is rooted in hard work and the pursuit of education. So, when my parents completed and obtained their higher education, their PhD, their master’s, they returned to Taiwan. Naturally, at that age, my brother and I went along. I was six at the time. My brother, who’s six years younger, was pretty much a newborn. I would say that move to Taiwan was certainly an adjustment. Luckily, at a young age, you’re pretty impressionable and you’re pretty resilient. I think if you think about Taiwan at that point of time, this is in the ‘80s, it’s a very homogenous place. 

I look like any other kid in my first grade class. I really do, did. However, having spent the first six years of my life in the U.S., English was my first language. I didn’t speak or write Mandarin. Thinking back at that period of time, despite how I looked on the outside, I was different. And being different was hard, and I learned that firsthand.

But in hindsight, that period of time was also a very valuable life lesson for me to learn about perspectives. Don’t make assumptions. Give others the benefit of the doubt. Walk in other people’s shoes. And there was more than what meets the eye. I remember one of those first exams that I took in first grade, I had this sudden realization that I was literally illiterate. I was unable to read or write. It was a shocking realization and a very difficult one. It wasn’t until after that first exam that I was told that Chinese is written vertically from top to bottom and left to right. Not being able to speak the language or understand the culture was also difficult from a social standpoint. Again, I had the benefit of being pretty young at the time. My parents, based on the school’s recommendation, pulled me out of first grade and I restarted in kindergarten. I often joke that I flunked first grade. Well, it’s true, I did. But again, I quickly assimilated and lived a very happy and privileged childhood.

I think the other pivotal moment or transition in my life was around the high school timeframe. It’s common understanding that the U.S. has one of the best education systems in the world, and you’re considered lucky if you can come to the U.S. for schooling, to follow this path and make the sacrifices, whatever it is, to seize this opportunity.

I came back to the U.S. for high school. Being a teenager, facing that transition, I would say certainly a lot more challenging than first grade or kindergarten. Once again, it felt like, even though I spoke English like an American, because I grew up here, the biggest challenge that I had, especially during your teenage years, is I didn’t know pop culture, which is critical to the social success of any teenager.

I bought new clothes, learned to tease my hair, very point in time, right? This is the early ‘90s. Listened to different music. Learned how to order from the secret menu at Taco Bell. Started to incorporate slang words into my speech and even learned pager code as a means to communicate. 

I desperately wanted to assimilate into this new environment, and I work really hard at it. It required a lot of learning, observation, and mimicking what others do. Till this day, I still have this innately strong desire to want to be accepted, to want to feel a sense of belonging and inclusion, and maybe just to be seen for who I am. And it’s sometimes maybe just not what you see from the outside.

[00:08:37] Sean: I love it. I absolutely love it. It’s so interesting. You have the inverse childhood that I had, which is that I was born in China and then I moved here when I was six or seven. But I can’t imagine what that was like. I remember vividly coming here and feeling like I was illiterate. But luckily, the U.S., at least the community I grew up in, had amazing ESL programs. I don’t imagine that Taiwan had an ESL program for you.

[00:09:10] Eileen: No.

[00:09:13] Sean: And you’re learning traditional Chinese, which is a lot harder than simplified Chinese. Right off the bat, you probably have double the amount of strokes, if not more, for every single character.

[00:09:25] Eileen: Right.

[00:09:25] Sean: I’m curious. So, your parents came here and had you while they’re doing their studies, but did you speak Mandarin at home or Taiwanese at home?

[00:09:37] Eileen: Yeah, Mandarin is our predominant language. We spoke a little bit at home, but my parents were also trying to learn English on their own to aid their own studies. I remember tutors coming to the house to help my parents learn English, write English. I distinctly remember my dad when he was working on his dissertation, having tutors in and trying to help him translate what he wanted to convey eloquently into English.

We did speak Mandarin at home, but perhaps, the reversal of a lot of other Asian families who are Asian American growing up here, my parents were actually trying to learn and improve their English to help aid their work on the education front. So, I spoke Mandarin. I would say it’s very basic. I didn’t frankly even know how to write my name in Mandarin. So, that probably gives you a sense of how limited my language ability was at the time

[00:10:45] Sean: Yeah. If you don’t mind me asking, what did your dad study?

[00:10:49] Eileen: History. He had a law degree from Taiwan and then he came here to study political science for his master’s, and then history for his PhD.

[00:11:04] Sean: I’m only asking because I can’t imagine, because you were mentioning the tutor helping translate and these things, that was obviously pre-Google Translate days long before.

[00:11:15] Eileen: You’re absolutely right. And then I think about my grandparents.

[00:11:19] Sean: Yeah.

[00:11:20] Eileen: Coming to Columbia or Stanford, I can’t even comprehend how challenging that must have been and the level of grit and perseverance and hard work, to underpin that.

[00:11:34] Sean: How much would you say your time in Taiwan influenced you, in terms of how you are today? I mean, it was just a short, what, six or seven years right before high school.

[00:11:46] Eileen: That’s a great question. And I very much identify now as a Chinese American, but there is a part of me that very much relates to that culture, whether it’s the more simple pleasures of food, art, music, or even the richness of the culture, that history. And I do think those six or seven years really define a lot of who I am today and my moral fabric.

[00:12:25] Sean: I’ve never asked anyone, any of my Taiwanese friends, this question before. And I’m curious about it because you mentioned the civil war right off the bat. And one of the things as an adult that I learned about the civil war and the Communist Party takeover in a cultural revolution was that they wiped out a lot of Chinese culture. I asked about this because, frankly, I grew up with my parents without much understanding of the richness of Chinese culture. We practice the Chinese New Year, the Lunar, the Mooncake Festival, things like that, but it was only until I was married to my wife, whose parents are ethnically Chinese from Hainan, but they grew up in Thailand, but they preserved a lot of Chinese culture and their customs and whatnots, that my parents and I weren’t even aware of. Let’s say tea ceremonies and things like that for weddings.

My understanding with the KMT in Taiwan is that they actually did preserve a lot of Chinese culture. So, it sounded like you did grow up with a very rich cultural understanding of your background, is that true?

[00:13:41] Eileen: That’s true. I also think back to that period of time in my early childhood. I think what I didn’t appreciate until much later is the fact that, yes, my family fled from mainland China to Taiwan, but so did, I think, a million other people.

And my grandparents on both sides had this strong sense of responsibility to provide for those who came along with them and to uphold that culture and those values that they were accustomed to when they lived in mainland China. Both sides of my grandparents came with people who supported them, worked for them. And they felt this really strong sense of not only having to provide for these individuals, to care for them, but also to continue the richness of the tradition, the culture, the values. So, they carried a lot on their backs.

[00:17:21] Sean: Love it. Love it. So, speaking of your college years, you got your BA in Economics. How did you get to business school, I guess, in that sense? What turned on your interest for business?

[00:17:31] Eileen: It was, first, interest in finance, in the markets, in anything that has to do with money management. And given the fact that I’ve lived in different places, international business has always sounded very intriguing to me. So, I started in economics, took some classes at Haas, and absolutely just loved every class that I took. Your passion, you’re good at it, it just becomes a little bit of perfect alignment of the stars, so to speak.

[00:18:10] Sean: And what would you do after college?

[00:18:13] Eileen: I graduated in 2001,a period of time that I would describe as the aftermath of the dot-com bubble.

[00:18:25] Sean: Tumultuous.

[00:18:27] Eileen: a little bit of a tough job market. I knew I wanted to do something finance-related. Frankly, I wasn’t wise or knowledgeable enough to really grasp how wide that industry is. And I certainly did not have an appreciation of how nuanced it is, either.

I started right out of school in an investment consulting firm, called Callan Associates, headquartered here in San Francisco. It was a research role. And what I was researching was the best and the brightest asset managers, we call them portfolio managers, in the finance industry. And I was in such a privileged seat, so green, right out of school, yet had open access to whoever I wanted to speak to. They would travel to San Francisco, sit across a large conference room table from me, and educate me on their background, how they became investors, the way they invest. And I think maybe most intriguing to me is what differentiates them as an investor, what makes them tick, what they’re passionate about.

It was absolutely fascinating. I think, for me, the biggest takeaways from that first job of conducting research was an understanding of, there are many ways to invest, alpha generation or generating returns above the benchmark is possible in any market environment, and to be a good investor not just requires skill but it requires tremendous judgment.

So, that was my first job out of college. And it was incredible. And I still consider myself to be lucky to be in that seat.

[00:20:39] Sean: How does that evolve into what you’re doing now?

[00:20:42] Eileen: So much of my currency is my network that I built, whether it’s from school or jobs, or industry connections over the last 20 years. I was recruited by the CEO of Artisan, who happened to have worked at Callan with me. Stayed in touch. He reached out and asked that I join him here at Artisan first in the distribution capacity— sales, client service, and whatnot. And then, a few years ago, asked that I take on a different role within the firm, which is the capacity I’m serving now, in a chief administrative officer capacity for Artisan.

[00:21:55] Sean: Throughout your time and career in finance, and this is a question around DEI, what are some of the positive changes that you’ve seen over the years for women in finance? And then, also, what are some areas that still have plenty of room for improvement?

[00:22:11] Eileen: By the nature of this question, we’ve seen progress. When I was early in my career, DEI was not in my vocabulary. I think, even as a woman of color, I have always thought, if there’s any shortcoming, that’s because I didn’t work hard enough, my work is not good enough, and a lot of self-reflection, rather than thinking I’m being discriminated against or “this environment is not favorable to somebody from my background or somebody who looked like me.”

I’ve never once thought that. And again, I’m not trying to say whether that’s right or wrong. It’s just we didn’t have that concept, didn’t have those words. To me, I want to, one day, get to the point of DEI should be like air, should be something that we breathe, we do. We don’t have to make an extra effort to highlight what we’ve done, to check a box, to write a check. It is just something that we do. And it’s very embedded in our DNA, embedded in our culture, embedded in our everyday language, actions. That, to me, is what’s going to define us as having success.

[00:24:21] Sean: Yeah, absolutely. You had mentioned just now people championing for you, mentors. What do you think you did differently to, maybe “attract” is not the right word, but to have these opportunities? How did you network differently?

Because “networking” is such a broad term, but I do think there’s a… I imagine there’s got to be a right way to network and a wrong way to network. If you were to think back to the past 20 years of your career, what were some things that you did differently to really attract people to champion you, aside from hard work?

[00:24:58] Eileen: If I were to think about areas where I might be doing things differently or where I differentiate from others, I would say, maybe one learning from my experience of so desperately want to assimilate into new environments, I’m a good listener and I care about people deeply. So, when I have a conversation with individuals, it gives me a starting point to ask about, “I know you and I have commonality in growing up in an Asian American household. I know you’ve had transitions similar to I have. I know we have Berkeley and Haas as something in common as well. I know you’ve dabbled in various areas in finance, maybe different than the more traditional asset management that I’m in.”

I think the fact that I really care about people, I want to understand where they come from, I want to be able to appreciate their perspective, whether it’s the same or, even better, different than mine, gives me maybe a more genuine starting point. And hopefully, that sincerity and authenticity comes across and is reciprocated as not just a launch pad to have that connection off the bat, but to really serve as a foundation to foster meaningful, long-standing, hopefully lifelong relationships.

So, I do think there is that piece where it was also a little bit of survival. I needed to do that to make friends, to fit in, to have a social circle. But if I really were to look back, I do think that’s maybe something a little bit different that I deeply care and listen and want to understand where you’re coming from, your background, how we’re the same, but also how we’re distinctly different.

[00:27:06] Sean: Absolutely. You very wholeheartedly embody our Haas principles, so much so, I wonder if Dean Lyons modeled it after you, because you have very strong qualities beyond yourself. And I say that because what you just shared is something… and maybe you’re absolutely right. And I never thought about this. We just mentioned, maybe, this is a survival skill that we gained to try to deeply understand other people because we grew up as such “aliens” in another world. I was literally an alien. I had an alien card. That’s what the green card was called.

[00:27:48] Sean: And then the whole confidence without attitude, just humility. I think other people really appreciate those two qualities, is humility and just and genuine interest in other people, the whole beyond yourself, that they would take a liking to you, that they would want to mentor you and help you because you’re so interested in them and not just yourself.

All right, to wrap up the interview, was there anything that you wanted to talk about that I didn’t ask you?

[00:28:20] Eileen: I used the words “privileged seat” a lot to describe my upbringing and my career path. I think any listener who’s currently at UC Berkeley or at Haas, you are in a privileged seat, you are at one of the best academic institutions in the world. Know your worth. You’re here because you’re exceptional. You worked hard to get here. And because of that, you have more opportunities than many, many other people have.

You have the power to push the world forward and make it a better place. I think about myself, not to be self-promotional, but being in the C-suite for a publicly traded company, being a woman of color, yes, it’s a privileged seat, but it’s also one that I don’t take lightly. I think representation is critically important. While I don’t feel like I’ve achieved success, and maybe I never will, I do think and I hope somebody looks at me and say, “I can do that, too. And that could be me one day.”

I would end on that to say, seize this opportunity, understand the privilege seat that you’re in, and make something of it.

[00:29:48] Sean: Well, Eileen, it was such a pleasure having you on today on this podcast and learning about your rich, rich family history.

[00:29:56] Eileen: Thanks, Sean, for having me. It’s great to be on.

[00:30:02] Sean: Thanks again for tuning in to this episode of the OneHaas Podcast. If you enjoyed our show today, please hit that Subscribe or Follow button on your favorite podcast player. We’d also really appreciate you giving us a five-star rating and review.

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OneHaas Podcast is a production of the Haas School of Business and produced by University FM. Until next time. Go, Bears!