Joshua Ahazie, BS 18 – Putting African Music on The World Stage

(Transcripts may contain a few typographical errors due to audio quality during the podcast recording.)

[00:00:00] Sean Li: This episode of OneHaas is brought to you by the Haas Fund, fueling opportunities for our students, faculty, and strengthening our Haas community. Join us in making an impact today at haas.berkeley.edu/give.

Welcome to the OneHaas Alumni Podcast. I’m your host, Sean Li. And today, I’m joined by Joshua Ahazie. Really excited to speak with Joshua. He’s actually calling in from Lagos, Nigeria. And it’s almost 2:00 PM my time, almost 10:00 PM his time.

So, thank you so much for taking the time to come on. But before that, I do have to introduce you. You know, Joshua is the founder and CEO at ATIDE. And he is also the marketing lead at Warner Music Africa.

Welcome to the podcast, Joshua.

[00:01:00] Joshua Ahazie: Sean, thank you for having me. It’s always a pleasure to talk to a fellow Haasie. So, yeah, I’m excited.

[00:01:07] Sean Li: Joshua, I love to start these conversations hearing about your origin story — where you grew up, how you grew up, even, you know, if you want to share about your family, your parents, we’d love to hear it all.

[00:01:17] Joshua Ahazie: Of course. So, I was born and raised in Lagos, Nigeria. And in our household, I think there was always a mix of music and entrepreneurship everywhere. So, my granddad, he collected vinyl records. My dad dreamed of starting a family band — never happened.

[00:01:36] Sean Li: Yeah, Haasie Five.

[00:01:37] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah, that’s a great name, you know. But every one of these people that I’ve mentioned were also business owners. So, my granddad owned and ran a pharmacy. My dad owned a farm, had consulted in the oil and gas industry, and my mom ran a couple of businesses while we were growing up. So, from early on I was always, sort of, exposed to people who were creating value in their own way, solving problems, but, you know, ultimately working independently.

[00:02:06] Sean Li: Yeah.

[00:02:07] Joshua Ahazie: So, fast forward to 2013, I moved 7,000 miles from Lagos to California to start university. I actually started off in BCC, Berkeley City College, you know, 2050 Center Street. And to be honest with you, Sean, I had no clue about the prestige of UC Berkeley. The only reason why I’d moved to California was because my brother actually was attending Berkeley. So, I was always constantly surrounded by the UC students because, you know, Berkeley City College and Berkeley, it’s like it’s a couple streets away. And people kept asking me, like, “Are you also free house?” Because I was studying business at the community college. And I’m like, “What are you guys talking about?” I had no idea what they meant, legitimately.

So, I got curious. I looked into it, and I found this video of Dean Rich Lyons explaining the four principles. And where I’m from, in Nigeria, education school is heavy theory, right? So, the first time, it was this campus and school that had values or principles that was very clear in their culture and they, sort of, embodied that into the learning process as well. So, I was drawn to the principles because that was pretty new for me. And I just ended up spending the next couple of months learning more and more. I was stopping people that were wearing, like, Berkeley Houseman, like, “How do I get into this castle on the hill, right?” You know, because it’s right there at the top of Piedmont.

So, I’d spend time envisioning myself on the campus, talking to the staff in the undergraduate office, but just literally stopping people with the Haas merch. And they were always so kind to give me some tips or, you know, recommend a couple of people to me. And I went from not knowing that this school existed to knowing that it’s exactly where I wanted to be and I needed to be. That’s, sort of, how I ended up at Berkeley Haas.

[00:04:07] Sean Li: I love it. What did your brother study? What was he here for?

[00:04:10] Joshua Ahazie: Pre-med. So, he did Berkeley and then he went to UCSS. He’s still in California, actually, right now working, has a kid, married. He’s amazing. And a big inspiration for me, man. I’m glad he went to Berkeley because I don’t think I care too much about school, if I’m being honest.

Education was pretty important to my family. My granddad became a pharmacist in, like, the ‘50s or ‘60s. He was one of the only pharmacists in his village. And he had promised himself that he was going to give his kid, my dad, the best education possible. So, I believe, for my dad’s masters, he actually got to school in the state in Atlanta. And then he made him promise that he would give his kids the best education possible. And that’s how we ended up at Berkeley. Another pretty cool fact is that I have three siblings. There’s four kids in our family. All of us went to Berkeley.

[00:05:03] Sean Li: Wow.

[00:05:04] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah, all of us went to Berkeley.

[00:05:08] Sean Li: That’s awesome.

[00:05:10] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah. It’s exciting. So, all Bears. All Bears.

[00:05:13] Sean Li: So, I am really curious. You know, you graduated in 2018, Haas undergrad. So, the Office of Communications and Public Affairs at UC Berkeley News, they had actually interviewed you back in 2018. And I listened to the episode, and the title of the episode for the podcast was “Haas Graduating Senior Envisions A Better Nigeria.” And Iove to hear what you’ve been up to since 2018.

[00:05:41] Joshua Ahazie: Man, I’m going to go back to, sort of, the genesis of ATIDE. So, ATIDE started off as a philanthropic project, right? Our focus was giving back with commerce. The name, by the way, it’s Yoruba and it means we are here. In the early days, we had launched this curated online store, in partnership with a couple Nigerian entrepreneurs who were passionate about social causes. And during my time at Haas, I was very inspired by brands like Tom’s, like, you know, the idea that commerce could fund impact in a very sustainable way, because as opposed to donations, you are actually building a customer, building an audience, and, you know, that can scale.

So, our goal was simple — to, sort of, help these local businesses reach the global audience while also funding meaningful social change. So, the profits from that store went into our first flagship initiative. It was called The Big Give. And we’re set out to improve the quality of education for 1,000 other resource students in Lagos, Nigeria, where I’m from.

So, we did our first school in 2018. We helped about 500 students with supplies, creative programs. We remodeled the entire school. And by 2019, we had reached 600 more. So, we actually crushed our goal of helping 1,000 kids in the span of a year and a half.

So, together with our partners, our customers, our volunteers, physically, I touched on raising the cash through these sales. We actually physically went to these schools, painted them, brought in new furniture, you know, gave the entire school supplies enough for, like, a whole term. And even in one of them, we actually built a full library, with, like, tablets and stuff. And in that same school, we’ve also hosted a bunch of, like, after-school programs, drama, arts, even a solar system. We actually installed a solar power system to, sort of, keep the school running off-grid, because, you know, bills are high and also pretty inconsistent. So, we were like, “Hey, let’s just go off-grid. And that’s been great. So, all that work is still incredibly close to my heart and laid the foundation for what ATIDE, you know, would eventually become.

What surprised me and my team was how people responded to the way we told our stories. So, we had this amazing team of creatives that were just as passionate as I was about our course. And people really loved the graphics, our visuals, our campaign videos, and they started asking us to help them with theirs as well.

So, fast forward to 2019, after years of flying from SFO to Lagos, I finally moved back to Lagos fully. And one of the biggest pieces of advice that one of my mentors in Cali, who was very reluctant about me moving back, he said, “to give money, you have to make money.” So, I started helping friends, artists, small brands, you know, with their storytelling, the design and their rollouts and video campaigns. And what began as me, sort of, keeping myself and our project afloat turned to a very real creative work. So, you know, we’re building these large campaigns. We’re helping artists launch their music in creative ways. And we’re designing and distributing merch around the globe. And our scope of impact started to broaden in real time. And we had a few key breaks. That made me realize, look, we’re not just helping people anymore. We’re, sort of, building something here with ATIDE.

Today, ATIDE is a marketing and creative company operating in content, strategy, commerce, and still community impact. And we’re doing that through three of our individual but also integrated arms. One is ATIDE Studios, which is our creative and marketing agency, where we focus on design, visuals, amazing campaigns for artists, labels, and brands, who are looking to, sort of, like, activate locally here in Nigeria.

We have Shop ATIDE, which is, sort of, the child of that initial online curated store that I had talked about for those entrepreneurs. So, on Shop ATIDE, we, you know, have artist merch and limited edition drops for whoever we decide to collaborate with, you know, photographers, whoever.

And, of course, we have the ATIDE Project, which is that nonprofit arm that’s still focused on education, you know, youth causes, whatever our team is, sort of, moved by in the period. So, we commit part of our profits from ATIDE Studios and Shop ATIDE. And that’s, sort of, what enables the ATIDE Project right now.

So, great work that we’ve been able to do, with everyone from emerging African artists, local businesses, global brands and global labels that are looking to, sort of, localize and activate meaningfully on ground within the Nigerian and the African markets. But I think that, ultimately, the mission hasn’t really changed. It’s always been about reflecting Nigeria in a very authentic way, reflecting Africa in a very authentic way, which is that we can be competitive, we can be creative, and we can have this global impact.

So, it’s been an amazing ride, an amazing journey. It’s, sort of, I love being able to merge my passion for strategy and business with, like, creativity and community in the ways that I do through these different divisions. I don’t think any of that would’ve been possible if not for Haas.

[00:11:26] Sean Li: That’s amazing. So, I, kind of, understand, you know, ATIDE’s angle and your vision for it, but how does it tie into music? Because I know you’re still very much involved with music. And, you know, we started this conversation talking about music.

[00:11:42] Joshua Ahazie: That’s the language I speak, man. I play instruments. I collect records. I love seeing artists perform. It’s such a vulnerable and expressive form of art. And even though we’ve worked across different industries — hospitality, nonprofit, e-commerce, gaming, whatever it may be, my most exciting projects personally are our music campaigns and our artists, like, rollouts.

So, interestingly, that’s also where we’ve also seen a lot of our big breaks, started doing work with modern music Africa and a couple of other companies and indie artists that shed really good light to what we’re doing as an agency. So, a lot of our clients on the agency side right now, and even in the merch business, are musicians. So, again, it’s the perfect way for me to blend my love for music with business and strategy and, you know, my consulting background.

[00:12:44] Sean Li: Do you mind sharing a little bit more about what you do with Warner Music Africa?

[00:12:49] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah. So, with Warner Music Africa, I currently serve as the marketing lead for West Africa. And that really involves us managing the campaigns for our local and global roster. So, apart from our local artists, if any of our affiliates in the global teams were looking at doing a campaign for some of our big artists locally, they would work with myself and, you know, my colleague in South Africa, where our HQ is in the continent, to localize those plans to drive the most impact and listenership for that artist internationally. So, it’s a mix of, developing campaigns for our very local roster, but also being a part of some really cool global activations for some big stars.

[00:13:32] Sean Li: That’s pretty awesome. How many record labels are there in West Africa? Do you happen to know? Like, big ones.

[00:13:38] Joshua Ahazie: Everyone is here, man. Everyone is here in some way, shape, or form, whether it’s, like, actually setting up shop with an office and a team or, you know, investing into, sort of, local imprints that could help with the entry of, like, a bigger partner. But Africa’s music scene and music industry, in general, has been growing consistently in double digits for the last couple of years now. I think we’re up about 20 to 23% last year. We crossed the $100 million mark for revenue as a continent for the first time ever last year, actually.

So, it’s a huge market that’s still growing and also a big export ground as well. I think, more than the monetary value that these companies get from the continent, because revenues abroad are more than revenues we generate per customer locally. It’s just a pool of amazing talent that, you know, if you’re lucky enough to find and develop and cross over, you have a gem. So, I think these labels are all in market because you’ll never know who the next Burna Boy or the next Ayra Starr is that can, like, you know, shut down global stages and, you know, give you those hits that people love, like CKay.

So, everyone is in the market — Sony, Warner. Universal just made a big acquisition recently with a local label here. So, every big player is here in one way, shape, or form. Even smaller labels that are trying to try their luck are also here in the region. So, it’s an exciting time for music. And we are super excited to be able to be a part of some success stories and, you know, contribute to how the world receives African music. You know, it’s exciting.

[00:15:31] Sean Li: That is exciting.

[00:15:33] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah.

[00:15:34] Sean Li: Let me ask you this question, because I’m actually, kind of, curious about this. And I’m curious if you have an answer for this. What do you think attributed to, kind of, the global rise in success and influence of Afrobeats in the past decade?

[00:15:49] Joshua Ahazie: I would say it’s a cocktail of different things that have always been brewing. I don’t think that the growth that we’ve seen in the last 10 years just, sort of, happened out of nowhere, that when people, you know, since the early 2000s, has, sort of, been pushing to get Afrobeats to where it is today.

But I’ll say, in more recent time, a couple of things that could have helped with the growth that we’re seeing now is just the confidence that we have in our identity. I think, in the early 2000s, we were, sort of, focused on fusion. How do we put in R&B with our sound and how do we put in this record with that one? But now there’s, like, being African is cool. And our artists are leaning into their identity of what it means to be African and make music as an African. I think that confidence in our Africanness has been something that has allowed us to, sort of, stand out in a very saturated music market, globally.

The second thing I would say is how connected we’ve become because of the internet, right, and social media. So, I think, whereas, before, even within a diaspora, it was difficult for information to go from local to global. But now, with one swipe, man, showing you’re in Lagos, and another swipe and you’re somewhere in, you know, Singapore or somewhere in Kenya or somewhere in London. And we’ve seen a lot of these records, like CKay’s Love Nwantiti or Ayra Starr’s recent records have success internationally. And that has brought more eyeballs into our music. It has made the DSPs, which are the digital stream platforms, like Apple Music and Spotify, it’s made them be like, “Hey, we need to, sort of, invest into amplifying this content more because, hey, CKay did a couple billion streams, you know, in a year or two. We’d love to see.” They start doing that in no time.

So, even if you look at it from a quantitative standpoint, the success in terms of streaming and TikTok or YouTube views or however metric you want to look at the trajectory of Afrobeats, those records are being broken quicker and stronger because there’s more acceptance and more reach with our music. And I think that collaborations have also helped Americans. And other people have seen that, “Hey, there’s something brewing here.” And we all feel it. You know, Beyonce did an album, you know, I think in 20… I forget the year. And it was primarily featuring African artists.

So many people come into Nigeria every December, and it’s a thing, right? Because they want to experience the music and the culture. And there’s been so many collaborations that have allowed our biggest stars to, sort of, cross over to an international audience. We talked about Wizkid, right? One of Wizkid’s biggest records to date is One Dance with Drake, right? Which came out at a time where it was the perfect time where Afrobeats was brewing pretty nicely. And then we get this huge co-sign and uplift and collaboration from someone as big as Drake. So, I’ll say that the world has become smaller, and it’s allowed for African artists to, sort of, shine with their uniqueness. We’ve made the world dance, man, with these different challenges. We’ve made the world groove a little bit more. And platforms like Spotify curating playlists that are specifically from Africa or Afrobeats friendly allow folks to fall into the fly trap of, “Hey, I like this Emiliana record.” And next thing you know, you’re streaming something else. And now you know three Nigerian songs. And by the end of the year, you’re seeing Ayra Starr, your Spotify Wrapped.

[00:19:32] Sean Li: Yeah.

[00:19:34] Joshua Ahazie: So, I think the last thing has just been, as we’ve mentioned, it’s been the investments from these global partners, seeing the growth that Africa is having. I mean, like, “Hey, we want a piece of this cake.” So, those investments have also made, and the presence as well have made it easier for the growth to happen, right?

[00:19:57] Sean Li: Yeah.

[00:19:57] Joshua Ahazie: So, that’s how I took my time in answering this question. It’s a cocktail of different things, sort of, brewed at the right time to get us to where we are right now.

[00:20:04] Sean Li: That’s a fantastic answer. And what amazes me, and I’m a musician myself. And I’ve actually been thinking about this as we’re talking, is, I personally feel Afrobeats, you know, at an internal level. I love it because it makes me feel something, you know. And I’m Chinese, you know. Like, I grew up playing… you know, similar to, you grew up playing some Beethoven and classical music and being exposed to jazz. But it’s just like, what is it about Afrobeats? It is just so appealing.

[00:20:38] Joshua Ahazie: Man, it’s the energy. It’s an undeniable feeling. And it’s that rhythm, man. It’s that groove. And I’d say it’s the hunger of the artist as well to, sort of, be discovered as well. It’s a mix of our amazing rhythms and melodies, but it’s that, like, our artists are putting their heart and soul into their body of work, right? It’s not just a hobby or something that, you know, there’s a ton of casts you could, sort of, fall back on, because the label’s cutting you a check of how much… An artist from Nigeria is looking at just how wide the world is. And it’s like, “I want to make a record that’s going to make the world dance.” 

I’ve gone to clubs and I’ve seen studios in the clubs. It gets me catch a vibe, but you’re inspired and you want to, sort of, get right into it, do a little test there in real time.

[00:21:33] Sean Li: In Lagos?

[00:21:34] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah, in Lagos.

[00:21:35] Sean Li: That’s crazy. That’s awesome. Wow.

[00:21:39] Joshua Ahazie: Shout-out to my guy, hello, Migi. Club’s name is Silk. Check it out. But yeah, I think it’s really just, like, it’s a competitive sport for us. It’s the energy. It’s the creativity. And I think the world is finally catching up. So, what’s the secret sauce? Again, it’s a mix of our uniqueness, our rhythms, our stories, and the hunger that we have to, sort of, like, be the best at what we do and reach as many people as possible. And I think that, when you bring that all together into one sonic listening experience, it’s like nothing you’ve ever heard before. That’s what I think.

[00:22:17] Sean Li: I think so as well.

[00:22:19] Joshua Ahazie: How do you feel when you listen to that music?

[00:22:22] Sean Li: I feel inspired. I feel motivated. I feel that authenticity of emotion, you know. It’s funny you bring up Drake. It just like, you know, like, his early albums, like, he was hungry, you know, as with most artists. And, you know, there’s a lot of emotion, I think, with young artists. And they’re living in a different world these days, the next generation. It’s just so amazing to listen to. Afrobeats dominates, I would probably say, over 50% of my Spotify playlist.

[00:22:56] Joshua Ahazie: I love it.

[00:22:57] Sean Li: And that’s why I was like, “I get to interview who?”

[00:23:05] Joshua Ahazie: Oh, man.

[00:23:05] Sean Li: That’s the universe working right there.

[00:23:09] Joshua Ahazie: Yes, man.

[00:23:09] Sean Li: That’s really cool. So, what else are you up to these days, Joshua? Is there anything, you know, on the horizon that you can share?

[00:23:18] Joshua Ahazie: I was like, man, there’s too much I want to share, but I can’t. You know, I’ll say I’m just excited for the world to see what we’ve been working on in recent months and years as well. For the most part, like, I think, ATIDE, we’ve done a lot of amazing work, but we’ve been in the background. We’ve been focused on building our clientele, building our capacity locally as well. But in Q4, I think we’re stepping out more intentionally and we’ll be launching our new websites, which really feels like a fresh chapter. We’re going to be showing a lot of our work and impact across the music industry, scaling up our merch division, and just, like, all these different exciting album rollouts that we’re, sort of, behind and a part of, on the agency level and also on the Warner level as well.

So, I’m excited. I’m excited for the season of growth. Everything that we’ve, sort of, worked on and how we’ve evolved from our strategy work to our creative work to where we are now, it just feels like a big moment of alignment. So, we are pretty clear on where we’re at and what we want to build. So, I’m excited for the world to see all of that in the recent quarters.

[00:24:27] Sean Li: And in terms of how listeners can reach out to you, what’s, kind of, the best way? How do they check out ATIDE? Or, you know, what are some ways that us, fellow Haasies, can support you?

[00:24:36] Joshua Ahazie: Of course, you can check out our Instagram, socials at Shop ATIDE, ATIDE Studios, ATIDE Project. That’s A-T-I-D-E. But beyond that, I think, support Nigerian creatives and support Nigerian businesses, you know — not out of charity, but because we are the moment. Whether it’s music, fashion, or film, there’s an entire generation of amazing people creating incredible work. Against all the odds, against all the systems that are, sort of, stacked against us. So, whether that’s ATIDE or something else, go support. We’re not emerging. We are here. We have arrived. So, get with it, you know. That’s how you can support.

[00:25:20] Sean Li: That’s awesome.

[00:25:21] Joshua Ahazie: Be like Sean. Listen to Ayra Starr. Listen to CKay, you know.

[00:25:25] Sean Li: Yeah. Hey, you know, speaking of which, what are some new names we should be aware of? I mean, I don’t know if you’re allowed to say what your favorite top three are.

[00:25:39] Joshua Ahazie: I’ll say across the board, because, you know, we do work with, on the agency side and of course on the Warner side. So, across the board, I’m excited about this band called The Cavemen, who were actually one of our very first music clientele. Their debut album, we had worked on the rollouts, the creative, you know, marketing, everything. That debut album came out when they were independent. Now, it’s many years later. And it’s, sort of, a full circle moment. Now, they’re signed to a big U.S. label, and they’re working on their third album. And we are working on the creative direction, strategy, rollout campaigns, and it’s so exciting to have artists that we’ve, sort of, grown with. So, I would say, check out and keep an eye for The Cavemen.

On the Warner side, we’ve done exciting work with an artist called Joeboy, who is, sort of, our flagship artist out of Warner Music Africa right now, set a couple great songs and a new album called Viva La Vida. Check out Joyce Olong, who is a fantastic singer, songwriter, producer, and engineer from Nigeria. She’s an independent artist that we’re currently working with at the moment. So, I love that we get to work with artists at different levels and we get to ultimately also grow with them, right? Whether it’s the agency or Warner as a label. So, those three names, The Cavemen, Joeboy, Joyce Olong. Check out their projects.

[00:27:12] Sean Li: How do you spell the third one?

[00:27:14] Joshua Ahazie: Joyce. So, J-O-Y-C-E, and Olong, O-L-O-N-G. She put out a project called SOSEO that we exec-produced. We also had the creative, the rollouts. We went to Ghana for about two weeks with some of the best directors, designers. We’ve sat in one house and we just cranked out the entire album and the creative and strategy.

So, one of my absolute best memories this year. She’s also a pretty good friend of the company. So, we always, like, love working on our campaigns and projects. The album is called SOSEO, a beautiful seven track ep that talks about love in different forms and vulnerability. And it’s our first project in about eight years. So, this was a very deeply personal project for her.

And yeah, those are my recommendations for some new ads. It’s not as groovy or as funky as the songs I know you like, but it does give you a sense of what is out there in space.

[00:28:12] Sean Li: As a musician, I love all music.

[00:28:15] Joshua Ahazie: What do you play, man? Tell me about your musical background.

[00:28:19] Sean Li: I played piano growing up, and so mostly piano. I DJ for a bit. That’s what made getting into podcasting so much easier because, you know, even I remember when I was editing, these are some of the skills that, you know, like, I took for granted when people say, like, “How did you learn how to do this? How’d you learn to do that?” Took me a while to realize that, you know, like, we are an accumulation of all of these little skills that we learned along the way, right?

[00:28:44] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah.

[00:28:44] Sean Li: And so, one of them was obviously I know how to count music. And so, you know, inserting music into podcasts came very naturally for me, because you can’t just randomly instrument music on the third beat, you know, the third bar. You know, you can’t do that. It has to be on the first or the fourth, you know. Like, that’s just how it works. But it’s one of these little things that we just know instinctively, right? And when people hear it, they know. And same when I was DJing, I love DJing, you know, within keys or within the circle fits, right, so that it’s harmonic.

[00:29:19] Joshua Ahazie: Speaking my language, man.

[00:29:20] Sean Li: I know. That’s why I was so excited to talk to this guy. It’s so funny. But I do have to ask you, so I remember hearing the interview, they said you played a bunch of instruments. What do you play?

[00:29:32] Joshua Ahazie: So, I play over 10 instruments, man. But by far, my favorite would be the piano, the saxophone. I appreciate the guitar a lot as well. I love the bass. But I would also really love to get better at acoustic as well. But I spent a lot of time by myself, like, growing up and fell in love with the expression of instruments, watching people play. So, I spent a lot of time in the music room. And I’ve had amazing stewards in primary school, high school, that just kept the, sort of, passion that I had and just kept pouring into me. And by the time I finished high school, I realized I could play a bunch of instruments. I had led the band and the orchestra in high school because of my experience and my years I actually trained. So, one of my very many tricks in high school was, like, “Pick a song and I’ll play right now on any instrument.” You know, that worked out pretty well.

[00:30:30] Sean Li: That’s really cool.

[00:30:30] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I’ve literally always been around music, always had parents and teachers that pushed me to learn more. And I remember, at a point in time, it becomes pretty formulaic, where it’s like, tone, tone, semitone, tone, tone, tone, semitone. If it’s, like, a melodic instrument, rhythm, it’s very natural for us on this side. So, after a while, I remember there were times where, like, my mom would be singing in the morning. This is when I knew I could start to really, like, get into music. My mom would be singing in the morning, that I could, sort of, see, like, the notes appear. And I was, like, I thought I was going crazy. But it was just all that exposure to her singing every single day, the same songs every day, and then me learning the instruments and being able to tie in what she was singing could look like across the board. And I just kept developing that. I remember my music teacher, when he found out that I could hear and transcribe immediately, man, I think he made me work even harder.

[00:31:31] Sean Li: That’s amazing.

[00:31:32] Joshua Ahazie: So, yeah, man. That’s a bit about my musical background. I, you know, didn’t get to play as much on campus. I think I took a couple of classes at UC Jazz, and I played every Sunday at my local church. Not too local. It was all the way in Pleasanton. So, I take the BART all the way to Pleasanton and I play the piano in church. So, that was my musical life in Cali. But apart from that, I have an extensive recollection of all 500 records, all hand-picked by me to, sort of, scatter around the place. There’s some right in front of me here in Lagos. There’s some of my brother in Cali. There’s some of my friends in London.

[00:32:12] Sean Li: I have to ask you, Joshua. Like, do you have time to produce music yourself?

[00:32:16] Joshua Ahazie: Whew, unfortunately not, you know. Actually, I’m going to take that back and say yes, because I do, like, write and compose, right? So, when I’m going to a jam session with people, I, sort of, have tunes that I want to explore with the group of musicians. And every now and then in the studio, I get to play or contribute to artists that trust my opinion.

So, that’s nice. It’s, sort of, like a co-production thing. My best friend is trying to get me to produce and be like, “Hey, dude, why aren’t you just doing everything you already do on the instruments, but on logic?” And I think, for me, it’s like, if I’m going to do something, I want to do it pretty well.

[00:32:57] Sean Li: The perfectionist curse. I know this.

[00:33:01] Joshua Ahazie: Yeah. So, I’m like, I open up logic. I’m like, “How do I do this logic thing?” And I think that overwhelms me, but I don’t think it’s far. So, in the future, I want to record music that I can also, like, sort of, curate videos for because, you know, we have a video production agency. I have ideas that I want to bring to life from music that I’ve composed that I’m like, “Hey, I want to see some type of visual thing to go with it.”

[00:33:24] Sean Li: I’m sure you dream of music, too.

[00:33:26] Joshua Ahazie: Actually, not. It’s crazy. I don’t have that. I’ve heard that so many times. A lot of our clients actually, they dream of the music, The Cavemen, like, they literally dream of the songs and they wake up and play it. I’m like, “Wow!”

[00:33:38] Sean Li: So, I’ll tell you this. Like, when I was learning production, I picked up DJing because I wanted to learn production. I wanted to produce music. You know, all my life I’ve been playing other people’s music, right? And I was like, “You know, I hear the music in my head.” And when I started learning how to produce, I would have dreams. I would have multi-layered track dreams. It was crazy. And I remember it because, you know, I could dive into each layer and hear each instrument. But then, once you wake up, obviously, it just, like, it poof. Like, I go sit down in front of the computer, I’m like, “What was that again?”

[00:34:14] Joshua Ahazie: “What was it again?”

[00:34:16] Sean Li: And it’s like, you know, just a basic chord that’s all you got left. But jokes aside, you know, I don’t know if you’re familiar with Masego and FKJ.

[00:34:26] Joshua Ahazie: Yes.

[00:34:27] Sean Li: I mean, you ever see them just, like, they’re just layering on music, like, instrument by instrument. But you could do that, you know. You know the instruments, you know. I still have to go learn the sax and, you know, learn all these other instruments. But, you know, you’d be amazed at what magic can happen. I think part of it is just, for me and from… I have a lot of, you know, living here in Southern California and LA, I have a lot of friends who are musicians. And they tell me, 80% of it is just letting go — letting go of the perfectionist.

[00:34:58] Joshua Ahazie: I am telling you, man, you know, now, we talk about music and dreams. There was one tune that I recorded in Berkeley that came to me in a dream, literally. First, I heard the voice note. And to your point about, like, how it’s easy for us to forget from that dream state, I was absolutely half asleep. And I don’t know how I picked up my phone and I recorded the… it was a line that, in my dream, was a trumpet. So, I heard the melody, like, half asleep, man. I don’t know how. Just recorded the thing. And then I called my guy who, you know, we had started work on sketch of what it would be a couple days before and I’m like, “Hey, we need to go record this and, you know, jam out on this one.”

So, that was one time that, sort of, melody came to me in a dream and retained even when I woke up. That song is called Amebo, and it means someone that’s restless. I think I actually talked about that in the Haas podcast because I think I just finished, like, sort of, writing the parts a couple weeks before. So, yeah, man.

[00:36:05] Sean Li: That’s amazing.

[00:36:06] Joshua Ahazie: I’m so glad that we could have this convo about music. It’s exciting stuff.

[00:36:09] Sean Li: Yeah. One more thing I do want to add, just to tie this more into Lagos, is that, I did just look this up and, you know, Mandarin is a very musical language, Chinese. So, I was actually really curious. Yoruba is also a very musical tonal language, unlike English. And I wonder how much of that, you know, ties into our musical ears, you know, and development and things like that.

[00:36:34] Joshua Ahazie: That’s very spot-on. The Yoruba people have an instrument called the talking drum.

[00:36:39] Sean Li: What’s that?

[00:36:40] Joshua Ahazie: So, it’s a drum that you, sort of, put around your arm. It has so many, I’ll call them strings. And depending on how you can bend the string with your elbow, literally, it sounds like it’s speaking. So, the most skilled talking drummers are able to literally use that drum to pass across messages or respond to people. And there’s different sizes of talking drums. There’s different uses for talking drums. But it’s literally called a talking drum.

[00:37:13] Sean Li: Wow, that’s amazing.

[00:37:15] Joshua Ahazie: Because it can talk. It can talk with those Yoruba tonations and, sort of, accent. So, yeah, I fully agree, it’s a musical language, if you want to describe as such.

[00:37:26] Sean Li: Yeah. That’s really cool. Yeah, just tying everything back, we’ll definitely share some of the things you mentioned, the links in the episode, for ATIDE, and then also the musicians. And I can’t wait to check out the SOSEO album, S-O-S-E-O album with Joyce. So, thank you so much for taking the time to come on the podcast, share your story with us.

[00:37:50] Joshua Ahazie: Sean, thank you.

[00:37:51] Sean Li: It’s been such a pleasure.

[00:37:52] Joshua Ahazie: Thank you so much, and I hope you have a lovely day.

[00:37:58] Sean Li: Thanks again for tuning into this episode of the OneHaas Podcast. If you enjoyed our show today, please hit that Subscribe or Follow button on your favorite podcast player. We’d also really appreciate you giving us a five-star rating and review. If you’re looking for more content, please check out our website at haas.fm. That’s spelled H-A-A-S.fm. In there, you can subscribe to our monthly newsletter and check out some of our other Berkeley Haas podcasts.

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